Rough sleepers under SGR rail bridge



  • Earlier, one of the 'bedroom's' inhabitants asleep across the pavement.
  • grennersgrenners Ferme Park Road, N4
    Has the new build up of homeless got anything to do with the Crisis charity shop?
  • grennersgrenners Ferme Park Road, N4
    Was feeling very uncomfortable today. Nipped into town and experienced 3 people begging in the tube carriage and then walked past the bedrooms with my Levi's from the sales.....surely homeless funding would be the last thing to be cut.....but where are the charities? And what use is our new Crisis shop?
  • edited December 2017
  • I don't think the volunteer shop assistants are asked to go out on the street and take on the cases. That's the job of the paid, trained Crisis workers.
  • On the subject of Crisis, it's a lousy choice if you're giving money - they spend a mind-boggling 35% of their income on fundraising. By way of comparison, St Mungo's spends a tiny 4%.
  • @grenners Begging on the railway (and for that matter, the bus station too) is a criminal offence. Those that are homeless do have some choices - and this ought to be one of them. It seems that the same bunch of beggars get moved on by the Police, but no further action is taken. The problem is particularly bad on SGR as it sits on the boundary of several Safer Neighbourhood teams As for charities providing help to rough sleepers - I'm fairly sure that the entrenched rough sleepers will have been seen by an outreach worker. But they have to want to be helped. Rough sleeping and begging may seem to them like a more economically viable option.
  • grennersgrenners Ferme Park Road, N4
    I can't see how anyone would choose to sleep rough in winter......
  • Do they actually sleep there over night?
  • grennersgrenners Ferme Park Road, N4
    Yes they have beds......
  • This is the most depressing start and end to my day! Anyone got artist impressions to what they are actually doing? If they are turning it into a tree lined boulevard it might be worth it!!
  • edited January 2017
    I am actively avoiding Station Place and going under the bridge.

    I use the Seven Sisters Road exit and walk up Fonthill Road, even if it adds time to my journey.

    Is Wells Terrace closed for good?
  • I totally agree. It is a total disgrace for the people who are sleeping there and people who are walking past every day...back and forth. I walk through Finsbury Park every morning, but I can't do that at night. Is it actually legale to do it? I do not know, but I can't be legal to setup a house on a pavement. There must be something wrong with it? I think I will start using seven sister to avoid it in the evening. It is terribly sad and disgusting. Police walk past regularly, but nothing is ever done. Maybe writing to the council would help? Or would it be the usual waste of time?
  • edited January 2017
    I would be happy to write to whom it may concern. Islington or Haringey councillors?
  • edited December 2017
  • @Fabuce: I saw Islington's street patrol talking to the rough sleepers a few evenings ago. As for whether the encampment is illegal - probably: The Vagrancy Act 1824 can be used to prosecute it - but Police are generally reluctant to criminalise rough sleepers. Begging on the railway (and TfL road transport premises, so in other words, the bus station) is a separate and much easier to prosecute offence under the respective Railway and TfL Road Traffic Premises bye-laws. The areas are on the fringes of different police areas,so there is a lack of joined-up policing. It seems the Met police NPTs don't work in the evening, and BTP has plenty to deal with on the station (it seems very ineffective dealing with those who are there). What is needed is a concerted effort between the council and Police divisions: Those begging are doing so in all of the respective police areas. The action the Police and council need to be taking (and perhaps are, be ineffectively) is to persuade rough sleepers to get help and then start applying the law if this does not happen. As I said earlier, it's all well and good offering help, but it seems it's not being accepted. There are also frequent reports here of what we might describe as 'professional' beggars. By which we mean ones that are not rough sleepers, but see the area as a soft touch, and begging as a way of earning a living.
  • Well I don't want to criminalise rough sleepers. I sympathise as much as possible, and I hope that a solution can be found. As I said it's incredibly sad to see people that have to live that way. Anyway I write to Islington Thanks for the thorough response @marko
  • I contacted Streetlink about the rough sleepers under the bridge on 2nd Jan; so I was a bit surprised to see that they were still under the bridge this morning. The young male+female couple weren't actually at their site, but they'd made their bed neatly before going about their business. Heartbreaking.
  • There are or were a few years ago plenty of beds from what I was told for homeless people, but many don't like hostels. A lot of the hardcore homeless are non-conformist and don't want to be institutionalised. I know that seems a bit trite considering their predicament but that's how they roll. Plus hostels are often full of people they don't like due to theft, drug use... They often have to share a room with such. At least on the streets they are with their own people who they have a bond and try to protect them.
  • edited January 2017
    Ooops, half posted a previous comment.
  • If you walk past the 'beds' after 1 a.m. (on a weekend night), you'll find them all entirely deserted; it's been this way for months and months and months... I'm afraid we've all been hoodwinked. As someone mentioned - many, many posts ago - certain persons begging in this location are actually the beneficiaries of council flats just off the Stroud green road and are 'begging' professionally: Moray road rings a bell. Unfortunately, no one on this site seems familiar/comfortable with the signs of opiate/crack cocaine addiction. I have seen numerous devices scattered about the SGR road which have been crudely fashioned into pipes for the consumption of crack cocaine; in addition -inevitably - consequent discoveries include rubbish that pertains to heroin abuse (foil/syringes) etc.
  • grennersgrenners Ferme Park Road, N4
    If you know that is the case then surely they should be reported to the police.
  • Perhaps you could share with us what to look out for?
  • Drj I had heard from people I know who have been going to work at 5am and there has been no one there which is why I asked the question a while back.
  • Yep, there's a house on Moray Rd that several rough sleepers use. Given the state of the people leaving it I suspect it's a hotspot for nefarious goings on and considering having a word with local police about it.
  • @Miss Annie Surely the Safer Neighbourhood Team can look into it?
  • edited January 2017
    Safer neighbourhoods are community engagement team, they are for things like graffiti, vandalism, car break ins - minor crimes. The Moray Rd house is one for the police.
  • The SNTs do other crimes too, at least in the early stages, including drugs.
  • edited January 2017
    No - Safer Neighbourhood teams are a Police team - typically Community Support Officers, a Police Constable and Police Sargent. They are ring-fenced for local, community policing duties. As far as I can tell, under the bridge is their patch. One of the issues with the begging and street drinking is that it happens when they are not on duty patrolling. Another is that the station is the British Transport Police's Victoria Line SNT patch, and the bus station is ambiguous. The Park (where much drug consumption and public urination takes place) belongs to yet another team in Haringey. The council does have community safety teams as well (not sure the precise title they use, but saw them engaging with beggars under the bridge the other night). One of their responsibilities is tackling anti-social behaviour. About 50% of the properties on Moray road are LBI council houses, and LBI is the freeholder of others (they were all once owned by LBI). The council usually offers these properties to trusted tenants. The use that @miss annie describes - both in terms of those staying there and any drug use - will be against the tenancy agreement, and the council probably has the most leverage here.
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