Should Samuel open a deli?

andy · July 2008

I've just remembered a place that I would like you to copy. It was in cape town (green point I think) and I was a proper deli - almost approaching a mini-mart size, with a little breakfast cafe in it. It did excellent eggs (the talk about eggs benedict reminded me of it) and juices and the atmosphere was just lovely. I love Cape Town.

Colette · July 2008

@ rainbow carnage - some of the staff are nice, some of them aren't. Just like in real life there are nice people and there are twats.

samuel · July 2008

Ok my deli and cafe were both in Eastbourne , just out of wellington ...i did use to do fluffies and they were free ....i wanted the parents there !
I am one of seven and i really like children so i would want a child friendly place , Parents need a place to go and have a break , i actually had a sand pit for the little ones in my nz cafe , very kiwi ,lol.

Lucy · July 2008

@samuel (not to harp on a familiar theme of mine) - and dogs? Anyhoo, aside from dog, would be great to have good bakery (god I miss real french bread!), proper cheese place and, not to be labelled complete hippy, somewhere you could get nice juices! not meat eater so, can't contribute to that side of things but would love fab cafe/bakery/place from green point! Don't mind the kids either - they love the dog! Think anti-kid thing a bit like anti dog thing - lived in france for a bit and was so nice to take dog everywhere, restaurants, bars etc. and the kids there were so well behaved. Think we need to be a bit more like that. Andy has just pointed out that posting drunk is probably not a good idea so will sign off before I get started on the CPZ and call everyone my best friend!

katiejane · July 2008

sorry lucy, but dogs in cafes and restaurants is just plain wrong in my opinion. not sure posting with a raging hangover is much better...

Philistine'sMonster · July 2008

Dear Samuel, (sorry but I’m unused to this “@” protocol because I don’t like the idea of anybody coming “at” me. I get enough of that on Stroud Green Road, and it makes me frikkend!) If memory hasn’t served me a half-measure, I think Tesco used to have some species of deli counter, meat booth or cheese dispenser, and that closed down. Why? I’ve no idea. Maybe you could ask them. There were two bakeries, as well. Alas, they too were gathered to the great breadbin in the sky. Instead we’re left with what was once a fine deli but which is now a garage with some nasty chairs in it. There used to be a charming little deli next to Home or Exit or Links (or whatever they’re called) several years ago but that didn’t last long – the principal reason being, I expect, that it was never open when you needed it to be, i.e. at the weekend. I’m no expert on anything, especially the market forces that drive the purveyance of fine meats and cheeses, but I get the feeling that something ain’t right… I don’t know how many subscribers here work in the Stroud Green area itself but those that do will probably tell you the same thing: that it’s a very different place during weekdays than on the weekend. I work for myself, so I’m on Stroud Green Road every day and although it’s steadily changing, it ain’t Crouch End or Muswell Hill. Yet. Despite the online community enthusiastically egging you on in your venture, I’m wondering how much of the real community would use a deli. Frankly, I have no idea. There are plenty of places selling coffee and sandwiches and they usually have customers during the day but I’d really love to know what your market research comes up with. Personally, I think it’s a fine proposal and I’d probably use your establishment for my lunchtime sandwich. But are the people in the online community a minority in the area? Are they able to give you enough business during the week too? Anyway, this isn’t supposed to be negative in any way, just a view from the other side, as it were. I hope you succeed, if only for my selfish passion for salami and dill pickle sandwiches. And if you have nice chairs I may even use your place to work from in the afternoon (but I doubt it ... I prefer the Haringey Arms because I bet they do a better Guinness!) Good luck, and bless ya. Phil. By the way, if you're looking for culinary ideas, there’s a very nice deli on the corner of Chapel Market and Penton Street, near Angel, that does unspeakably good things with an aubergine…

matt · July 2008

I agree, as somebody who also works from home a lot, that it's a different place during the day - nicer even?! Sadly, I may not work from home forever.

Philistine'sMonster · July 2008

Nicer? Well I like it but I'm biased -- my family has lived here for nearly 30 years. It still seems that there are, during the week, fewer of the young and “trendy” (sorry, a dreadful word), but that’s changing too … It's interesting to hear from people who have lived and worked here for 10, 20, 30 years or more and what they feel about the area. I work in television and I've noticed a steady increase in "media" types (I know, another dreadful word, please don't call a constable). I’m not sure how many of you have been into the Wetherspoons for a lunchtime drink or one of the meal-deal/curry-and-fist-specials on a weekday afternoon (I wouldn’t blame you if you hadn’t, but I promise you it looks scarier than it really is). You’d be surprised at who’s in there some days; from artists to plumbers to screenwriters to actors to – well, I’m not going to "out" anybody here, you’ll just have to go in and talk to the people there. Stroud Green Road, compared to some of the bores of the clubs of Soho, has some of the most interesting people I’ve known. Hey, we could always arrange a Christmas party in Sam's deli for those of us who are self-employed and stir-crazy...

rainbow_carnage · July 2008

I work from home, too, so I would very much like a nice place to get decent coffee and cake at 3pm on a weekday. Ideally at 9pm as well, but apparently that's asking too much. I probably would not buy takeaway sandwiches because I can make my own. I would buy a sandwich to eat in, but if you're going to have children running all over the place, I doubt that I could sit there long enough to eat one.

The bakeries failed because they were crap. One of them insisted on putting a sticky glaze on everything. The other was just dull, with mediocre croissants at the same prices as Valerie's.

If I wanted second-rate baked goods, I'd buy them from Tesco.

I think the people of SGR appreciate quality food. That is why Petek & Jai Krishna are always full, without any advertising or even a website. Cats seems to be doing good business, too.

The mediocre places that don't offer anything new don't last. There is too much competition. You have to stand out. If you're going to open a cafe/deli, you have to make sure that the food is mouthwatering enough to make people leave their houses and the coffee is better than they could make at home. Otherwise there is no point.

And we are talking about leaving houses, not offices.

On a brighter note, we don't have a Pret here yet, so there isn't much lunchtime competition.

Philistine'sMonster · July 2008

Glad that’s solved... After all the posts I’ve managed to work it out. So it seems, Sam, the correct formula for a successful business is actually pretty simple: Top Quality = success. Mediocrity = failure. I don’t think by that rule you can go wrong. It’s a no-brainer. But it can’t be that simple, I’m sure. The devil, as they say, is in the detail so you need the following too. Cakes at 3pm and 9pm (no baking inbetween please) A drop-in box No children No dogs Decent coffee (and it has to be DECENT coffee, mind) Mouthwatering food good enough to make people leave their houses (but not their offices. People in offices don't know about good food, trust us) Good bread (not decent bread, GOOD bread) Child friendly Dog friendly Proper fluffies (with marshmallows -- none of these improper ones) Eat In & Take Away (but not both at the same time) Good ham (no bad ham, please) No pre-packed sandwiches (we want to WATCH you wrapping them) An enthusiastic welcome And it has to be called Flat White See you soon, then! Seriously I think it's great that everyone cares about something like this and I look forward to seeing if you can meet their high (but not unreasonable) standards. xxx

Agaton Sax · July 2008

What about the waitresses? Would there be waitress service at this deli?

rainbow_carnage · July 2008

most people who work in offices go out for lunch daily. i, on the other hand, can open a 50p packet of cous cous in my own kitchen, add some boiling water and have a healthy-ish meal in less than 5 minutes.

that's what you're up against in this area.

Philistine'sMonster · July 2008

A simple packet of cous-cous... Beat that Sam!

matt · July 2008

Yes, price is going to be your sticking point if you offer all that good stuff

tosscat · July 2008

Don't forget the waiter's tips!

katiejane · July 2008

I work from home too, and I'd love it if I could just pop out and get a really lovely tuna mayo sandwich of a lunchtime, instead of having to make it myself once I've sorted the kids' food out. Even better if I can enjoy a lovely coffee there, and have them fix me a sandwich for me to take home. Perfect.

Colette · July 2008

How could you choose shop-bought tuna mayo over home-made couscous? heathen.

andy · July 2008

You simply could not buy research of this quality.

Toddlesocks · July 2008

I work from home too, could be tempted out in the afternoon for tea and scones if the place played some good music and did not have everyone practically sitting on each others knee and strictly no screaming kids.

tosscat · July 2008

Re. the couscous debate. When you say packet of couscous, is it one of those preseasoned things that are just add boiling water, like a [Pot Noodle](http://www.unilever.co.uk/ourbrands/foods/Pot_Noodle.asp) or a [Batchelors Savoury](http://www.britishcornershop.co.uk/britishfood.asp?id=TJ0706) rice? Because if it is I would be with katiejane even with my tinned tuna issues.

rainbow_carnage · July 2008

@ andy - I'd like to think that we're not a representative sample of SG. You're talking about a group of people who spend hours discussing the local area, but who can't be arsed to actually go out and meet their neighbours.

@ tosscat - It depends on how lazy I am on a particular day. The pre-seasoned packets of couscous take less than a minute to prepare. The real thing takes around 10 minutes, depending on what you want to add to it. And I've recently discovered 5-minute dry spaghetti.

Did anyone watch the Dispatchers sandwich documentary last night? I love the outrage and pseudo-science. People who cannot take the time to read the nutritional value of their lunch should not get to complain about the salt content. And who the hell thinks that cheese is a low fat food?

katiejane · July 2008

@ RC & Colette - re: couscous. What are we talking about here. Just plain couscous? No thanks. Stick it with some roasted veg, harissa & goats cheese or olives, anchovies, tomatoes, french beans, lemon juice & olive oil - yumm! But I'm way, way too busy to put in all that prep on lunch just for me. I'm not talking about one of what I call plastic sandwiches that have a shelf like of like ten days, but a freshly cut sandwich on some really good bread (not pre-sliced), and I'm thinking the tuna mayo should be mixed with some red onion, or spinach maybe. As for Dispatches - so what if you're going to eat a third of your RDI of salt for lunch - hell when are you going to eat the rest? Breakfast and tea? Lame stuff - pretty much what you'd expect from Dispatches.

jandb · July 2008

I look forward to next week's revelation - beer contains alcohol and cakes contain sugar.

Colette · July 2008

@Katiejane - I was joking about the couscous. Plain couscous does not constitute suitable lunchtime nutrition in my books. It's like having plain boiled pasta, or rice. What's the point? Give me tuna mayo anyday over that.

matt · July 2008

How about my lunch today of (Swedish) blue cheese on (Swedish) ginger biscuits. Yes, we went to IKEA on the weekend. Oh, and I had Sainsbury's Moroccan style (spicy!) humous on toast, because I'd run out of pitta. So, so lazy.

Agaton Sax · July 2008

I had some lard, with some salt.

What did everyone else have?

andy · July 2008

I had an apple and a can of 7up.

tosscat · July 2008

I had black beans 'n' stuff.

sophie · July 2008

i had a tuna mayonnaise sandwich that i made, with a little bit of cinnamon sprinkled on it. i hated that dispatches programme, i hate it when they ask stuff like: "which do you think has more fat, two double cheeseburgers or this lovely m&s sandwich", and the questionees always get it wrong. how?! why would they be asking you if it was the cheeseburgers?! idiots. though i am more of an idiot for sitting through 45 minutes of it.

tosscat · July 2008

Hey Sophie, is the cinnamon thing nice?

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