Stabbing in Wray Crescent park

edited June 2011 in Local discussion
It seems that a young black man was stabbed in Wray Crescent park about an hour ago. There's a multitude of police cars and ambulances gathered on the corner of Tollington Park - even the air ambulance landed in the park.

From what I could tell, the man was wounded in his right leg but not seriously. Some nearby residents from St Mark's Mansions took care of the man until he was taken to hospital, so huge respect to them.

Part of me wonders if this involves the vaguely threatening groups of youths one can see hanging around in the park now and again. I can only hope this is a one-off incident and that the young man recovers soon.
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Comments

  • edited 4:57PM
    I found the victim. Seems like a estate to estate tit for tat. Hope the young man who was stabbed is ok. He was taken to the Royal London.
  • edited 4:57PM
    There has been a spate of gang on gang incidents on Wray cres over the last few weeks building up to this incident. This probably won't be the end of it.
  • edited 4:57PM
    The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • Things had been relatively quiet recently - but there is a lot of history between the 'Wray Crays' (apparently) and Elthorne estate. And I wouldn't be surprised if it's related...
  • edited June 2011
    This is not a surprise. Around 6.15pm i watched 10-15 lads all hoodied up making their way down Almington and thought that something was going to kick off "somewhere". I was pleased i got through them without a slap. It appeared overt, these guys don't give a ****.
  • edited June 2011
    They were from local flats. The victim told me he was in the park and the gang approached him, asked him where he lived. He said another estate so they stabbed him 11 times. The victim is 28.
  • edited June 2011
    I cut through the park every evening. Never seen any problems other than just general loitering, so that does surprise me. But then I don't get the peculiar 'get off my turf' behaviour of young men - not ever having been one. Sounds like he's probably not mortally hurt, so that's good, and well done for looking after him. Does make me concerned for my other half who crosses the park regularly, and my stepdaughter who plays in it. Although I recognise that the former is much more of a real risk than the latter.
  • edited 4:57PM
    Oh sorry, and daft question, but having just seen the youtube link (and I recognise at least two of those kids from Crouch Hill Ct) I assume that it's been passed onto the police?
  • All very close to home... At the weekend I was helping out at the (excellent) Wray Crescent Festival. Last night my kids were telling me all about the helicopter that landed there...and sg.org fills in the blanks. Poor bloke. Fair play to everyone who got involved and helped him.

    That YouTube film is incredible. Such credible bragging. From such scarily familiar local faces.

    Not much extra info here, but a bit on the history of the kids in the YouTube film https://sites.google.com/site/londonstreetgangs/gang-lists/north-london-gangs/crouch-hall-court-c-blocks
  • edited 4:57PM
    I also often sit there of an evening just watching the world pass me by daydreaming...But woah... last night the image from the Yorkshire Tea box was replaced by scenes from The Wire. Hope the kid is ok, and plod pull out there finger and catch those responsible.
  • edited 4:57PM
    I live on Birnam Road. If the runts corner me and ask where I'm from, what's the best thing to say? Wales?
  • edited June 2011
    I just got sent this by a neighbour

    Tollington Safer Neighbourhood Team are asking local residents if they saw or heard anything relating to an incident of serious assault which occurred on Tollington Place yesterday 21/06/2011 at 18:30 hours. If you saw anything, before during or after the incident, which may help police with their inquiries, we ask that you do please call or email Tollington SNT as soon as possible.

    Although I'm guessing that any of you on here would obviously have contacted the police to pass on info, if you had any.
  • edited 4:57PM
    I've already given a statement based on what I saw and what the victim told me before he was taken off in the air ambulance.
  • edited 4:57PM
    @Mills the police are well aware of what is on youtube. The gang vids are monitored continually as part of intelligence gathering. @Drumbeg don't worry you are not a target. The gangs aren't interested in targetting "civilians" in that way (apart from muggings). The local gangs all know each other, know who each other is. I highly doubt the victim wasn't known to the perpetrators and vice versa. @those who do not see gang activity in the area, that is because you have no reason to, you don't move in those circles, you won't necessarily notice.
  • edited 4:57PM
    I've just spent the last half hour watching some local gangs rap videos on youtube. Some of these guys can actually rap well! The comments are insightful in a way too.

    Big up Da Beauvoir Town Man Dem. Brap.
  • edited 4:57PM
    As Drumbeg said these gangs don't give a damn about middle class people having tea on Wray Crescent. It's a turf war thing between what they see as equals. 'You're not from my estate and I don't like you' is the attitude. Maybe they are interested in your money or laptop? However gang life is more about power in regards to turf than just robbing.

    I'm not saying it is always the case but if you're a middle class person prancing around here you won't get much hassle (apart from some exceptions). It's a very domestic thing for many gangs?
  • edited 4:57PM
    Sorry, it was n't Drumbeg but Siolae
  • edited 4:57PM
    I think that to call these groups "gangs" glorifies and validates them in a way they don't deserve. To be a "gang" gives the group an identity, when in fact they are gangs of playground scallies who live in the same block and who people are scared of because they carry knives. So they carry knives and stab people in order to elevate their group of scallies into a proper gang. So people call them gangs. So they become gangs, which seems like a self-validating cycle. And if the best identity you can get comes from a group like that, rather than through a school or family or city or other expression of community, then something has gone really wrong somewhere. It's the poverty of aspiration that's so depressing. How have these kids missed the point that a life lived like this is shit for all concerned? And instead decided that the important challenge in your life is establishing superiority over someone who is having a slightly more or less shit time than you in a nearby but slightly different estate?
  • edited 4:57PM
    I used to live in the end house of Wray Crescent and, because of that and having once taught in a prison, got reasonably friendly with the young lads that lurk in the park.

    They appear to be quite a threatening mass and are, I'm sure, totally moronic in how they approach their own kind from different postcodes, but were always incredibly polite and friendly to me and made me feel much, much safer whenever I had to walk through the crescent late at night - perhaps because I spoke to them with a semblance of humanity and equality.

    They were, though, drug dealers and this sort of nonsense goes hand in hand with that. I did see them stock-piling bottles and stakes for a battle once, which I did not like the idea of - someone fortunately called the police - but I am sure there will be some form of retaliation soon.

    I am glad to hear that the guy isn't too seriously injured and to work out what the helicopter was up to the other night. I am also pleased to hear these lads attract the same good treatment from our emergency services as I would hope to. I always assumed they wouldn't.
  • edited 4:57PM
    Well said Andy.

    It is also beyond me how these kids fail to see the bigger picture. I grew up on a council estate and managed to do it; I didn't have a broadband Internet connection at my disposal either.
  • edited June 2011
    @Timmymc
    Do you have any idea in what kind of danger you putting boys from "local estate" by saying that it was them who stab the man. I dont think police advice you to share whatever information you got.
    I was 1 of the first people who called 999 that evening. That was when I saw about 30 boys in local estate. After living in this area for 18 years I can asure you all them people was not from local estate.
  • edited 4:57PM
    For those who don't understand the motivations I recommend the film Quadrophenia, considered a classic by many, including various celebrities. Here's the [IMDB synopsis](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0079766/plotsummary). It has some great and some overrated tunes by the Who, an old band, and various Northern Soul tunes.
  • edited 4:57PM
    Most local people are quite aware of where some of the tensions have been emanating from. Fair enough, perhaps I didn't realise. I was only going by what I was told. If it seems to be a wider issue then so be it.
  • edited 4:57PM
    Think before you act!!!
  • edited 4:57PM
    well said deol91..i am also from this area and have 3 young kids,i am always in wray cres every evening and dont see anything bad going on.all i see is young boys with no where to go,sitting around laughing and jokeing.they have always been polite to me and my children.they even play foot ball with my kids.i dont think its right nameing and shameing young boys on here and they didnt even do it.its wrong,u dont no who has seen this and now have put all there lifes in danger by stateing what u heard.u do relise now your statment cant be used in a court of law as u have shared it all over the internet.people need to get a life of there own and stop puttng other lifes in danger!!!
  • edited 4:57PM
    This guy made a statement <b>based on what he saw and what the victim told him</b>. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that. It's what you're meant to do.
  • edited 4:57PM
    That's not the issue.

    I think the problem is that the information is now in the public domain (this forum) and retaliation could occur based on this.
  • edited 4:57PM
    As Drumbeg says the issue isn't with Timmymc telling the police exactly what he saw, the problem is with people posting links to videos and speculating on where the people responsible may be living. The police are taking this really seriously, they've been around to our flat to ask if we've seen anything and there were detectives out around the park until midnight the day it happened. They're obviously worried about revenge and tit for tat attacks and it's irresponsible for people to post rumours and speculation on a public forum.
  • edited June 2011
    Unless a comment was deleted, Timmymc never stated in this discussion who carried out this stabbing other than the victim told him they were from ‘local estates’ and ‘local flats’. If anyone takes exception to the characterisation of ‘nice’ local lads made by posters OTHER than Timmymc then maybe a change in perception of what constitutes ‘nice’ is needed. The police are very smart. I think they can work for themselves what happened and who was involved. But if people are bullied to not come forward to give statements about what they have seen and heard, problems won’t be resolved and the situation will get worse. If anyone is worried about material in the public domain then I think the worry should be about who posted that video on youtube (which has now been taken down) rather the link posted to it here.
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