Cosmopolitan Stroud Green Road

Donna · November 2011

Does anyone else remember there was a really interesting article in one of the newspapers a year or two ago about how cosmopolitan Stroud Green Road is? Interviewing loads of the shopkeepers and finding out where they are from... I'm sure it was posted on here but I can't find it on here or on Google. Was hoping to send it to a friend of mine, anyone remember it?

poxy · November 2011

Here's the thread... http://stroudgreen.org/discussion/990/stroud-green-road-in-the-times-this-saturday-july-19/p1 The article itself is now behind The Times' paywall.

Donna · November 2011

ah thank you!<a href="http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/life/article1855200.ece">http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/life/article1855200.ece</a><h1 id="title" class="f-ha"> </h1>

Donna · November 2011

ooh it says about Stroud Green Road: "Ho Chi Minh is said to have once lived there, while in 1878, a young Pole named Joseph Conrad found lodgings in the neighbourhood."

Kaz · November 2011

Ah, I though this might have been a thread about cocktails...

poxy · November 2011

I want to read the article again. Does anybody have subs to The Times?

gardener-joe · November 2011

...

Donna · November 2011

Here you go - have to paste it into different comments as there's a limit on word count:<h1 id="title" class="f-ha">The British dream: multiculturalism</h1><a name="p"></a><a name="tab-1"></a><a name="tab-2"></a><a name="tab-3"></a><a name="tab-4"></a><a name="tab-5"></a><a name="tab-6"></a><div class="cf "><div id="tabs" class="article"><div style="min-height: 216px;" id="tab-1" class="noImage tab"><div class="background"> Tim Pozzi<div class="byline-timestamp"><div class="f-regular-update">July 19 2008 12:20PM</div></div><div id="bodycopy"><div id="page-1" class="contentpage currentpage">A writer trawls a London street to hear 10 remarkable stories of hope and patriotism from immigrants who have settled thereOn an ordinary, slightly tatty street in Finsbury Park, North London – an area best known nationally for the mosque in which Abu Hamza used to preach – people from across the globe, from Somalia to Vietnam, Pakistan to Peru, live and work side by side. Amid ongoing public debate about the impact of immigration, London has developed into the most multicultural city in the world, with people from 243 nations (according to the 2001 census) now neighbours. Stroud Green Road, with its ecelectic shops and small businesses, is a patch that has long attracted immigrants – Ho Chi Minh is said to have once lived there, while in 1878, a young Pole named Joseph Conrad found lodgings in the neighbourhood. But what of today’s settlers? And what are their thoughts about the land they now call their home? Tim Pozzi walked the 1,056 yards of Stroud Green Road, and listened to ten remarkable stories of migration, hope and new British patriotism.Click on the slideshow to see pictures of each of the intervieweesSunflower Gallery: Burkan C., 41Born Istanbul, Turkey“Finsbury Park is a very cosmopolitan area, and that’s why I love it. It’s beautiful. You get Brazilians, English, Greeks, Turks, everything – it’s really nice in terms of that. Different cultures – you learn something new every day. “When I first came to London from Istanbul in 1986 I had this image in my mind that it would be like LA, or New York. To be honest when I arrived it put me down a little bit. Because I didn’t know the place, I didn’t have many friends here then, and for the first few months I was really, really bored. I wanted to go back so many times. “I was studying for a BTech in business studies at Haringey College. As soon as I got my diploma in business studies – well, it was never my intention to live here you know – I was gonna go back. One of my friends from college, also from Turkey, said, ‘Do you wanna go to uni?’ I said, ‘Look, I can’t afford to go,’ so he said, ‘No no, come on I’ll lend you some money, we’ll stay together,’ so I said, ‘All right then.’ “So I went to university and studied international business administration. I finished that. Then I got married. But the marriage didn’t work out very well. We got divorced after three years. </div></div></div></div></div></div>

Donna · November 2011

“Then I started to do a masters degree at North London University. After that I met my second wife. We’re still married, and we have a daughter, Ceren. “I opened two businesses actually. First there was a restaurant in Enfield, which did very well. We sold that – which I regret now – and bought a restaurant and nightclub in Highgate. It was a big mistake. I got into a lot of problems with the council. I had to close it down after a couple of years. We went bankrupt. “I run this florist’s shop now – I rent the premises from my uncle – and I also drive a minicab for the firm next door. “What I like about England is that everything is more or less in order, compared to Turkey. You have the security of the government behind you. The social life is good. Also, there is always a job for people who work – at least, I’ve never had any problem finding a job here. The downside of the UK is crime, and I hate the fact that the police have to concentrate on traffic offences instead of proper crime. Also, I think they have too much paperwork to do. “I’m a British citizen now. Whenever I go back to Turkey, I realise how living in England has changed me, in terms of obeying traffic rules, speaking to people, you know. In that way, I have changed. In Turkey it’s a bit faster, intense – being Mediterranean, people can just freak out there, very quickly “It’s my belief that if you have immigrants like me, it’s good for the country. We bring a different culture, and a new way of understanding life. We tend to be entrepreneurs, we invest in business and that opens up opportunites for English people as well. “I would like to go back to Istanbul one day. I give myself another nine or ten years. I really want my daughter to go to university here, and then she can decide whether to stay here or come with my wife and me to Turkey. But for now, I love London. I wouldn’t think of living anywhere else.”Chinese Medical Centre: Ming Liang Chen, 50Born Qingdao, China“I was a doctor in a state hospital in Qingdao. My daughter wanted to study in England, and so we moved here in 2000.

Donna · November 2011

“My daughter went to university in Southampton. Now she’s married and has a son and lives in Colindale in London. I see her every day. That is Chinese culture – children and parents stay together. “I am now self-employed. Luckily for me, Europeans are becoming more interested in herbal medicine and acupuncture. “I don’t know if we will stay here. I miss my friends and colleagues in China, and my wife is very close to her family back home. Life for us here was almost impossible for the first few years? My English is not so good! If my daughter is settled, I think we will return to China. We will see.”New Beacon Books: Janice Durham, 51Born Grenada“My family was very poor, and I lived with my mum in a house no bigger than a large room, together with my grandmother, my aunt and two uncles. “My mum had a cousin in Trinidad, Milly, who was a teacher. She came over to Grenada when I was about 3. Milly saw me, and saw the set-up, which she didn’t think was good for me, and said, ‘Oh, what a cute child. Let me take her away and I will look after her in Trinidad.’ So I was taken to Trinidad, but every school holiday I went back to Grenada. “Then Milly decided life would be better for both of us in England, and we came over in 1969. I was 12 years old. I remember it was cold, grey, smoke coming out of people’s houses? I thought to myself, ‘Oh no, I want to go home!’ You’d be walking along and everybody always wore a serious face. I hated it. “We moved to the Midlands, and I went to school in Northampton. I was one of only three black children in the school, which was a huge culture shock. “After school I trained to become a nurse, and I met my children’s father, Michael. I got pregnant, and Milly was so disappointed: ‘Oh! I wanted another life for you!’ she said. We moved into the flat above the book shop here, which was started by Michael’s father, John La Rose, and his partner, Sara White. After Ronaldo was born I used to help in the shop every day, until Sara asked me if I wanted to work full-time.

Donna · November 2011

“It’s not just a bookshop. It’s also a publishing house, and above the shop is the George Padmore Institute, where people come to study black writers from Africa and the Caribbean and all over. It’s an amazing place. I get to meet a lot of interesting people – poets like Linton Kwesi Johnson. It’s really a wonderful space to be in.”C.M. Upholstery: Constantin Mosteanu, 68Born Bucharest, Romania“People in the West don’t understand what communism is. It is living by lying. If you lie, you go upwards. If you don’t lie, or tell the truth, they push you down or they kill you. “I first came to England in 1977. I was an engineer in Bucharest, designing machinery for the manufacture of planes. Ceausescu had the licence to build the BAC-111 in Romania. They would send people to England to learn about the technology, but they were relatives of generals or ministers, not those who were actually building the planes. It wasn’t right. I went to my boss and, in the end, because we made a lot of noise – which wasn’t really done in communist times – they sent me here for two weeks. “We became something like friends with our English colleagues. They invited us to their homes. We had a security man with us all the time – a group abroad would always have a security man with them to keep an eye on us. One man especially was extremely hospitable towards us, inviting us to his home for drinks one Saturday night. “When he came on a return visit to Romania, I was not even allowed to say good morning to him. You weren’t allowed to speak to foreign people without a Securitate man there. It was embarrassing. It upset me a lot. I said good morning to him when he came anyway, I didn’t care. “I returned to England again in 1979 for three weeks. I came here, I saw, I liked what I saw, and then I went back. Life was still OK in Romania, I was never thinking to leave. But we had no food? “Then, in 1982, I was in another team to come to England. I had problems at the factory because I was like a revolutionary, and I told my wife, ‘I’m not coming back. If I stay here I will go to prison or go crazy.’ I went up to a policewoman at Waterloo, and she took me to the police station. I was surprised at how kind they were, how respectful. “In Romania, I was sentenced to seven years in prison in my absence. My wife lost her job. My daughter’s head teacher said to her, ‘Your father is a traitor!’ I said, ‘Tell them they are the traitors, because they have brought the country down.’

Donna · November 2011

“To start a new life when you are 42 is not easy. And you come in the dark. I had learnt upholstery as a boy, from my father. I started doing some chairs for my landlady, and then for her friends. I found a job at Luton airport and sent money home. When I felt I was on my feet, I opened my own business. “My wife and daughter came here two years after me. My daughter was 11. I had to put her in private school. It was a sacrifice, but I was very disappointed by the schools here. They were taking drugs, they were burning her with cigarettes in the toilet... People from Eastern Europe make better schools. “But there is nowhere like England. What I liked a lot was that I had a foreign name, but to customers it didn’t make any difference. I made a portfolio of my work, they trusted me, and business went up and up. This I appreciated. I felt like it was my home. And I had freedom – this was my pleasure.”Los Guadales restaurant: Luz-Elena Lamprea, 38 Born Tulu?, Colombia“I’ve spent half my life in Colombia, and half in England.My parents divorced when I was 4, and my mother had come here to make a new start. She’d been here for 18 months already when I first arrived. “I was 19, and London was a shock to me. When you are in Colombia and you think of Europe, you think of amazing buildings, lots of life, beautiful weather... I arrived on September 9, and the weather was so horrible. Piccadilly Circus was my favourite place. Every night, rather than go home, I used to go to Piccadilly Circus and spend two or three hours there, just hanging around and talking to people. “I studied English for a year, and then I found someone – I fell in love and got married. The marriage didn’t work, but we had two children: Jennifer, who is 14, and Julian, who is 11. “When the opportunity came up to buy this restaurant, I was a bit unsure because most of the Latin American community is in South London. But still people came, and most of them are Europeans. I am here six days a week. It feels like seven days a week, 24 hours – there’s always so much to do. But I love this job – I am not just serving food, I am giving people an experience of my culture. “Sometimes I wonder what would have happened to me if I’d never left Colombia. I think, ‘I’d never have a restaurant, I wouldn’t have my kids?’ I don’t know, but I’m so thankful that I came here. I can say that I am now 50-50 English and Colombian. I go to Colombia every year, but when I am there I miss England. I really love being here.”

Donna · November 2011

M A Shah Dentist: Mehul Shah, 51Born Nyeri, Kenya“My mother tongue is Gujarati. My family has been in Kenya for around 100 years now. Both of my grandfathers went to Kenya from India. “As a teenager growing up in Mombasa, I decided I wanted to do medical studies of some sort, and really the only way to do that was to leave Kenya. Although I had an uncle over here, it was a very hard thing for me to do. I was only 16. “I remember the drive from the airport to my uncle’s house, and the roads seemed huge, massive. Of course I hadn’t seen roads like that in Kenya. The houses looked very similar, all of them the same. That was a bit of a shock. I came here in the summer, the weather was lovely. But of course, the first winter that came – that was a shock! “I’ve been here on Stroud Green Road for 26 years now, and I’ve seen a huge amount of change. This road used to be all clothing factories. Now they’re mainly eating places. There used to be a lot of people here of Cypriot origin. Now there are more people from Eastern Europe, people from Africa. My patients are of all nationalities, all religions, all colours. I love it. I’m seeing the third generation of the same families now. “England has a very adaptable society, but I also think you have to embrace the culture that you live in. My children were born here. All their friends are English. You cannot expect your host community to embrace your culture. “I feel British now – I became a naturalised Briton about 24 years ago. Britain has given me education, and the opportunity to better myself. This is my country, my home.”X-IT Homewares and Gifts: Nikos Andronicou, 51Born Ora, Cyprus

Donna · November 2011

“I came to England to study at the London College of Fashion. For three years I learnt design, pattern cutting, manufacturing? I had a cousin who was well established here, a manufacturer of ladies’ garments: he was exporting to Arab countries, mainly Libya. He wanted me to come and and help him, which is what I did. I’ve been living and working here since then. It will be 30 years in November! “And I have lived to see a lot of changes. When I first came, this area was full of Greek Cypriots. Many were refugees from the Turkish invasion of Cyprus in 1974. They were very productive people – half of the shops on Stroud Green Road were run by Greek Cypriots. “There was a crucial time when Yvonne Fletcher, the policewoman, was shot outside the Libyan Embassy? after that exports to Libya stopped immediately. All of those who were exporting to Libya had to look for something else to do. Slowly it changed, and now there are very few Cypriot clothes factories round here. Their kids grew up, they all studied, they are all professionals now – solicitors and accountants and doctors and teachers. “There isn’t a day goes by when I don’t think of Cyprus. It’s always in my plans to go back one day. I always tell my kids, ‘You should never forget where your ancestors came from.’ For me, to be a complete person, you need to know what you are, and I’m trying to teach my kids that they are Greeks. “Britain is a lovely country and I like it here, but you always think of back home and where you were born and brought up. Those first 20 years are the most important ones, I believe. That’s the case with me anyway.”Chez Liline restaurant: Thierry Doudrich, 39Born Paris, France“Who is pure English in London these days? I think London is itself a mixture. And it will always be like that. “My name is Dutch – I think it goes back to the 17th century – and my family comes from Mauritius. My grandfather was Chinese, and my grandmother was Indian. It’s strange when I tell people this – they hardly believe me. Anyway, when Mauritius became independent from Britain in 1968, many Mauritians left the country, and my mother decided to go to France. I was raised in Paris. “The rest of my mother’s family, though, was based in England. In 1986, my uncle had the shop next door to here, a fish shop, and my aunt had a clothes shop next to it. There was an opportunity to buy this place. I think more than anything it was a matter of having the family together, so we bought it, and turned it into a fish restaurant. It’s because the family is quite strong that we are here – when times are rough, family is always there.

Donna · November 2011

“I’ve been to Mauritius twice. I felt it was important to see where my mum came from, where my grandparents are buried. Just to be in touch with my background. It was quite an emotional time. “When I was there, I met members of my family – distant cousins, aunts – and they look at you, coming from Europe, taller, and bigger, as if you come from another planet. I recall my uncles showing me the place where they caught the boat to England. It was such a big thing for them. You can imagine: one member of the family manages to move abroad, settles, probably sends some money home to help the family initially, then maybe to help a brother or sister to come over. There must be some heartbreak for the family, for the parents, as bit by bit, they see their children go – yes, the children have a better life, but the parents know they won’t see them so much? “I remember one member of my family calling me and saying, ‘We’ll meet in a restaurant on Sunday.’ When I got there, expecting maybe a table for four, there were three tables of ten. The guy had brought the whole family. And I’d never met him before. I got to meet his brothers, his sisters, in-laws, kids. That really struck me, the fact that although they’d never met you, family was everything. “For me, Stroud Green Road is a bit like Mauritius – you’ve got different communities, different religions, but generally people live well together. They complement each other.”Nuchem Dispensing Chemist: Mahindra Patel, 62Born Kampala, Uganda“I grew up in Kampala, but left Uganda when I was 15 to move to India. Four years later I came to the UK and I studied to become a radio and TV engineer. I worked for Rank Bush Murphy in Borehamwood for eight years, and later I had a newsagent’s in East Acton, where I worked virtually non-stop for 17 years. I had to sell the shop when my dad died – I was alone in the shop and I couldn’t manage it. “We had a tremendous amount of struggle after that, and I was lucky to get a job in this pharmacy. The pharmacist is like a younger brother to me. He treats me very well. “I’ve been working here in Finsbury Park ever since – 17 years. We used to do medicine delivery, and so I know all the old people round here, and their children. All the shopkeepers too. Everybody. I can’t go anywhere without bumping into some of our customers. “I am thinking of going back to India some day, although I feel more British now than anything else. I’d like to see my three daughters settled down first though, and I also have my mother and younger sister living with us, so I can’t just get up and leave. I’d like to stay with them as long as I can.”

Donna · November 2011

Style Opticians: Mohammed Haji, 56Born Rangoon, Burma“Because my father is Indian (my mother is Burmese), I was not allowed to study for a professional degree in Burma. I did a BSc in physics, but it wasn’t very useful. “I worked briefly in France and then, when I was visiting England, I met my wife, Farida. I hadn’t meant to settle here, but I proposed to her. My wife is also from Rangoon. She had come over here at the age of 12 in 1967, and I ended up working for my in-laws’ optical practice in Stoke Newington. “I started on my own here in 2000. We have two boys, one 17 and one 13. I am from a very basic, poor background, so this is the good life for us. Now, with my financial support, my family can survive in Burma. “This is still a democratic country, one of the best in the world – what more can you want? “I am a tolerant person... But there is too much freedom. When you have fanatics coming to this country and preaching, it’s not good. Thankfully my children are free from that type of influence. I am happy that they are very modern, they are very British.”

Nick10 · November 2011

Brilliant. Thank you very much for posting.

Donna · November 2011

you're welcome

Howdy, Stranger!

Categories

In this Discussion

Top Posters

Cosmopolitan Stroud Green Road

Comments