Cyclists

Peter Crumb

Thanks alot for the link Miss Annie!<div>I grew up alot further East near the seaside town of Withernsea (near Bridlington and Hornsea if you know it?)</div>

miss annie

Chap asks - is the John Bull rock factory still in Brid?

vetski

Saw a cyclist on SGR the other day - wearing headphones AND texting as he sailed across the red light by the Sainsbury's-to-be. Should probably be taken out for the good of society...

Peter Crumb

It was last time I went (two years ago maybe).

Ali

<P>Graeme  I cycled 10 kms to work this  morning and  counted over two hundred cyclists on my route and most people seemed okay apart from a few Boris bikers.  Your away over the  top on 90% so one can only assume that you have soem issue about cylists.</P> <P>Twins park where you are in the cycle box should be related to whoich way yo are going to go.  Left for left etc tells the mororist what your going to so. While you in the box it is good to get eye contact with who ever is driving.  Chang should try it he might meet a few more women other than in Sugar Lounge. Maybe a smells therapist  might be useful !</P>

graeme

The point was you have your opinion, and I'll have mine which from experience of cycling sees the vast majority of them running junctions whenever they like, failing to indiciate etc.  Thanks for your input, it's more worthy now you have provided numbers rather than just protesting someone's opinon that you didn't much like.  I'll remember to do my exhaustive empirical research before posting next time.  One can only assume you have some issue with Boris bikers.

Ali

<P> The bikes I don't but Boris  that is a different story !</P>

Ali

<P>Interesting Australian reseach on cycle crashes  </P> <P><A href="http://www.monash.edu.au/miri/research/reports/muarc251.pdf">http://www.monash.edu.au/miri/research/reports/muarc251.pdf</A></P>; <P>probbaly applies  here       </P> <P>This is also interesting about New York, sounds familiar  </P>

Ali

<P>The New York link</P> <P><A href="http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,2118668,00.html">http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,2118668,00.html</A></P>;

ADGS

I see a lot of bikes playing silly buggers on crossings &c, but literally every day I also see at least one motorist - and usually more - going through after they should have done on the Tollington Park/SGR crossroads, Fiveways, or on Seven Sisters. If my journey takes in all three, it will likely happen at all three. And as for the pedestrians blithely wandering across the road a few paces from a crossing...<div><br></div><div>In summary: most people are arseholes. This does not change according to their method of transport, all that changes is the amount of damage they can do.</div>

Papa

Some of these comments made me think I'd stumbled across an extended Littlejohn column.<br><br>I cycle eight miles across London and back, five days a week, year-round and have done so for almost seven years.<br><br>Some of the behaviour I see from cyclists drives me mad: sailing straight across red light junctions, ploughing through pedestrian crossings with people on. I dislike it, not because it is against the law - which when it comes to cycling urgently needs updating - but because it is rude, discourteous and dangerous.<br><br>Every time I see someone do this, I think: 'Great there will be at least another motorist or pedestrian who saw that and thinks "bloody cyclists they deserve everything they get."'<br><br>This bad cycling behaviour increases the dangerously high level of antagonism between pedestrians, motorists and cyclists that clouds any sensible debate in this country on road use and any hope that we can move forwards sensibly. (See evidence above.)<br><br>My personal view is that we need to re-educate all road users and move towards everyone understanding each others' different needs, sharing limited space and as ADGS points out avoiding being arseholes.<br><br>The starting point should be similar to Andy's SG.org mantra: Be excellent to each other.<br><br>My opinion, as a cyclist motorist and pedestrian, is that the reason so many of the rules are flouted is that some should be adjusted for bikes - because a bike is not a car.<br><br>My view is that my responsibility on a bike is to be courteous and respectful of others and that takes precedence over me getting places quicker and makes my life more pleasant.<br><br>So that means never go through a red light on a pedestrian crossing if there is any pedestrian even close to it, never go straight across a junction on a red light, never ride down a pavement when a road will do or at faster than walking pace, always presume a pedestrian doesn't know you are there and be polite to them, always indicate where I am going to go, always say thank you.<br><br>BUT if there is a red light on a pedestrian crossing and no-one anywere near it, I can go through it, if there is a red light on a junction and it is safe to turn left and I disturb no-one by doing so, I can go through it, if I need to use a clear pavement for a very short space where I cannot use a road and I go no faster than brisk walking pace I can do that. Yes, I know I am breaking the law of the land but it is common sense and my courtesy rule always takes precedence.<br><br>Cyclists shouldn't be obnoxious but pedestrians also need to look where they are going - and not just step blindly into the road, then get stroppy with a cyclist who has screeched to a halt or swerved to avoid them. <br><br>[TwinSpark - <a href="http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAndTransport/Highwaycode/DG_070108">the Highway Code</a> says pedestrians don't have the override-all right of way you suggest, it actually says: 'If you have started crossing and traffic wants to turn into the road, you have priority and they should give way.' That doesn't mean you can blindly walk out in front of anything you like that is already on the road or indicating to turn into it.]<br><br>I should add that in all those years riding to and from work, I have seen cars and buses hit cyclists (and pedestrians), the tragic aftermath of a cyclist hit down the side of a lorry, pedestrians hit by cars, and a woman brilliantly whack a cyclist who had ploughed through a crossing over the head with her handbag, but I have never seen a cyclist hit a pedestrian. <br><br>I also did a quick survey on my way home the other day of how many cyclists obeyed red light signals at junctions they and I were meant to stop at. Four out of 23 ignored them - just over 17%.<br>

Ali

<P>Spot on Papa L </P> <P>On my route there  are usually more cyclists than car drivers </P>

Idoru

Brilliantly said, Papa L. In fact if people adapted your courtesy rule for the rest of life the world would be a better place.<br>

nick_m

<p><em>Disclaimer: I have previously jumped red lights on my bike, via a green pedestrian crossing light (and by propelling forward with my feet not pedals), when I have my son on the child seat at the back and a juggernaught is sitting in the cycle box at a major junction (most notably at the Hornsey Rd/Seven Sisters Rd junction). I am trying to put as much distance between us and this dangerous situation as possible. Sorry.</em></p><p>I think London is much better than when I started riding years ago. Drivers are more aware and courteous, and cyclists seem to understand their place better. There will always be those on the margins who ignore this, of course.</p><p>Cycling infrastructre could still be an awful lot better. The London Cycling Campaign (LCC) is running a 'Go Dutch' campaign to improve road conditions for cyclists. I urge you to support it (<a href="http://lcc.org.uk/pages/go-dutch">http://lcc.org.uk/pages/go-dutch</a> and identify areas where you think improvements can be made. I'm personally pushing for a dedicated cycle lane all the way down the Hornsey Road; there is plenty of space and I don't see why not.</p>

yagamuffin

Not a huge fan of cycle lanes myself. They encourage cyclists to ride in the gutter and encourage motorists to continue at their high speed as if they would using lanes on a motorway.