bomb shelters

Detritus

I assume anyone from the lower end of sgr would have used the underground during the war for shelter. The only place I can think of that people at the top of sgr could use would be the tunnel between crouch hill station and Holloway Road station. Can anyone put me right. I know that at first the underground wasn't allowed to be used as a shelter but that changed sharpish. Was there a communal shelter in Stroud Green? If so where?

Perflexed

Pure speculation here, but… the park? <div>The destruction of London's infrastructure was a key objective, with the demoralisation of the population to be realised through this. Even in today's bombing hotspots spokespersons for some of the involved parties are keen to stress that they are not actively seeking out and killing civilians, rather they just happened to be there, in, or adjacent to, the 'legitimate' targets, (although this legitimacy does seem to occasionally stretch to a hospital, or school, or a beach, or what have you). Would you be safe in the middle of Finsbury Park?</div>

ADGS

Nobody would be *aiming* for the park - but even after 70 years of massive advances, bomb aiming is an imperfect craft. And running into a big open space when death is raining from the skies would be psychologically tricky.

Detritus

The park would be logical but I doubt it.

Thomas

Plus I think there was a massive anti-aircraft battery in the middle of the park...which might have made it a target in itself!

minim

No idea about bomb shelters but, whether deliberately or not, Finsbury Park was bombed quite a few times: http://bombsight.org/?#15/51.5701/-0.0935<div><br></div><div>And <a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/ww2peopleswar/stories/25/a4164725.shtml">here</a>'s a (short) witness account from someone who lived on Isledon Road.</div>

Ali

The Park was coverred  in allotments growing food<br>

Thomas

<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2"><span style="line-height: normal;">Just came across this:</span></font><div style="font-family: Arial, Verdana; font-size: 10pt; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; line-height: normal;"><br></div><div><font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2"><span style="line-height: normal;">http://hansard.millbanksystems.com/commons/1949/mar/08/requisitioned-land-finsbury-park</span></font><br></div><div><font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2"><span style="line-height: normal;"><br></span></font></div><div><font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2"><span style="line-height: normal;">Funny to think that local annoyance at the fencing off of parts of Finsbury Park is no new thing!!</span></font></div>

gardener-joe

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Perflexed

So, probably not the park then -- anti-aircraft wotsit, American troops & fruit and veg. Must remember to never ever speculate. <div></div><div><br></div><div>Not that relevantly, but my father lived on Endymion road in the '50's and I remember him telling me that the pond in the park was a very popular venue for "courting couples" I was quite young at the time and didn't know if he was being euphemistic or not, nor had I even any concept of euphemism, but I wonder if it was a hang over from the US troop base, oversexed, overpaid etc…Oh bollocks more speculation.</div>

gardener-joe

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Peter Crumb

What are barrage balloons?

Liz

When I moved into my first flat off Tollington Park, we discovered the foundations of an Anderson shelter in the garden. So possible that many of the big Victorian houses had their own.

Ilovegreyhounds

The house next door to us still has an Anderson shelter in the garden (Cornwall Road).

Detritus

Barrage balloon were like small tethered zepplins arranged at different hights, some had small baskets attatched for spotters and the cable they used was a wire one and it stopped low level bomb runs but most particularly they were good against dive bombing there was around 3000 over london. They were used in the trenches during ww1 a little for spotting

Detritus

http://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/11704 This is in the imperial war museum, shame it's not a photo.

WiltshireCourtBoy

gardener-joe and Thomas. The barrage balloon centre for FP was where the cricket field once stood (think it may be baseball today) between Endymion Rd and Green Lanes is. I know for a fact because I had 2 aunties (lived in TPL - Raleigh Rd) who used to man them and one of them got into big trouble because they let one go. It is also near hear that the Hornsey Wood Tavern stood (Hornsey Wood evolved out of the Manor of Brownswood from where the road name came.) Stroud Green and FP (where the Astoria and Campbell Bunk stood), in the doomsday book and middle ages was just marsh land until it got to where Hornsey Rd runs. Until around 1880 where Blythwood Road stands was a natural pond and spring which used to run down to feed the marshes until  it was redirected as they developed SGR area. I even have an old photo of it Blythwood Ponds, but I can't work out how to load photo's onto this site.

gardener-joe

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Arkady

@WCB - if you email me the picture(s) I will host it and post it for you.

WiltshireCourtBoy

Its Marquis, sometimes at night as a kid we could hear it. Crouch Hill, Musewell Hill, Ally Pally and Highgate Hills are actually glacier skree from the last ice age pushed into London Clay. Crouch Hill was originally called Mount Pleasant and it was a stream draining this ridge that feed Blythswood rang along where they built the railway from Highgate to FP (crossing the old SG station in Stapleton Hall Rd). I looked up my photo (its a shame as I have around 300 old photos of the old Hornsey Borough) and I have marked it as 'Mount Pleasant Ponds - where Bythwood Road now stands. I don't know if they will do it but i'll email it to Arklady and ask them to pass it on. If you get it please let me know (I will also send a very old one of Stapleton Hall Rd. The reservoir on Crouch Hill was built by the New River Water Company in 1882 and is filled via a pumping station from the New River. Much of which today is underground between Hornsey Station and Endymion Rd.  FYI My father was born in Playford Rd and my gran in Alsen Rd, both Campbell Bunk area. I was born in Highgate, but when my fathers business failed we moved from Sheldon Av (opposite Kenwood) to the flats in 1960 when I was 8. What a rude awakening that was! I lived in the flats until 1980 and then in Stapleton Hall rd near the library until 1990. Between 1963-70 I was the main paperboy at Johnsons the news agents and I can tell you a few stories that you see walking the streets at 5.30 am! Ha ha ha. At present I am working on writing a piece listing all the shops and places I can remember from the 60's between Hanley Rd and Perth Rd. So I have a few memories.

Detritus

If you wish I'm more than happy to scan any photos you would like to be digitised. Really interesting things you are telling us so thank you.

WiltshireCourtBoy

Thanks Arkady sent

gardener-joe

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WiltshireCourtBoy

<p>Thanks Detritus, I have a scanner and can post email style, just not clued up on how to post pictures to a blog?</p><p>I will make more posts. With regards to Campbell Bunk I have studied the area quite a lot for two reasons, first I was amazed why my great grandfather moved to the area with my young grandfather in the 1880 from the village of Pirton (nr Hitchin and 5 miles from where without any prior knowledge I was living). Searching though the 1881, 91, 01 census I was amazed to see how many of the people living there had come from within a 5 mile radius of the village, many were related to my family or certainly well known. Fascinated I research my great grandfather on my grandmothers side and saw him coming from Leckhampton ne Cheltenham and I delved further, discovering the development of the area (how it was built and why FP became London's equivalent of Harlem for exactly the same reasons). Building up a picture it also explained my father to me who up to then remained something of a cold enigma. Then last year and now retired, I started writing a book I have called 'The Street Arabs' its about 2 boys born in CB in 1919 and tracks their very different lives up to the 1973 Moorgate train disaster (which ironically in car 5 I survived) where their lives are suddenly thrown back together...and they discover the answer to a secret. I have finished the structure and as you can see the story, all that is holding me up is my writing style which has developed the more I have written. Nevertheless I hope to finish by this time next year. </p>

Gloria

I have an allotment on the Evershot Rd site and apparently that too had an anti aircraft battery located on it during the war...

Arkady

<div>Three new pictures on my flicker, courtesy of WiltshireCourtBoy:<br><br>https://www.flickr.com/photos/67014684@N05/<br><br>The second is Stapleton Hall, the third is Mount Pleasant Ponds. The first WCB will explain!<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2"><span style="line-height: normal;"><br></span></font></div>

WiltshireCourtBoy

<p> Thought I would first post a piece of SG history. In 1961 New Court Congregational Church (the main non catholic church in SG at the time) moved from a humble church in Everleigh Rd to a new star shaped church in Regina Rd. The latter is still there though by the 70's it had changed course as the area became more multi cultural. In the same year to celebrate the churches 400 hundredth anniversary (from its start back in Holborn) it held a show telling the story of the church via a series of short acted scenes and narrated by the Sunday School teacher, a girl of around 12 and me aged 9. We sat there narrating for 3 hrs, quite an ordeal for a itchy pant kid!  Posted for Gloria.</p><p>The second is of a late 19th century painting of Stapleton Hall.</p><p>The third as promised for gardener-joe is a very early photo of Mount Pleasant Ponds - which was situated where Blythwood Road now stands.</p><p><br></p><p><br></p>

gardener-joe

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WiltshireCourtBoy

<p>If that is the big church like a Roman Temple in Tollington Park opposite Fonthill Rd then that's right, that was part of the story, but when I moved to SG in 1960 the church had already moved and was in a small wooden church in Everleigh St and the big church was already catholic.  I looked it up on google it was on the right hand side about 10 yds up on the right and now it looks like its a garage or something. The local cubs and scouts also ran out of the same church and also moved when the church did. Like many boys once puberty kicked in I stopped going to the church and by then the scouts, instead I joined the ATC (13F Sqn) that ran out of the top of Ally Pally where the golf course was. FYI when you descend AP towards the station on the left hand side used to be a large gap where a building had once stood (years since I went back so I'm not sure if it is still there) but until 1960 a large Swiss Chalet stood there which had moved there from the great exhibition in 1952. Sadly in 1960 it burnt down and the space remained open for years. </p><p>I also found this article in the British Library which confirms both our facts. </p>

WiltshireCourtBoy

New Court Cong. chapel, Tollington Pk., built 1871 by worshippers from New Ct., Lincoln's Inn Fields, whose chapel had been demol. for Law Courts.  Neo-classical bldg. by C. G. Searle, with giant Corinthian portico, seating 1,340 in 1884.  During ministries of Campbell Morgan and J. Ossian Davies often full, but attendances declined <i>c</i>. 1900 with migration to outer suburbs. Attendance 1886: 1,053 a.m.; 1,326 p.m.   Attendance 1903: 734 a.m.; 633 p.m. Chapel sold to St. Mellitus Rom. Cath. ch. 1959;   members moved to temp. chapel in Everleigh Street until 1961.   New Court Cong. ch., Regina Rd., opened 1961; closed 1976.   Mission at nos. 88 and 89, Campbell Rd., 1884, seating 300; svces. Sun. and Wed.

gardener-joe

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