• You tell me over and over again, we're not on the eve of destruction. Finsbury Park Developers Paradise wins.
  • Young professionals = Interns 'with a bit of help'
  • grennersgrenners Ferme Park Road, N4
    I think you will find its probably everyone under 40 who has a fairly average income not just some snotty nosed brat.
  • grennersgrenners Ferme Park Road, N4
    Surely we can't live in Victorian Houses for ever and ever and ever whilst the city grows. In other countries people accept residential buildings have an economic life and will be replaced eventually. In 300 years when we are all crammed 10 to a room in Victorian houses?
  • edited April 2017
    Two things to note here. Firstly, the properties aren't lived in as houses or conversions at the moment:

    'The row of properties at 3-27 Wilberforce Road currently houses the Central Park Hotel, which remains open for now despite being sold off in a multimillion pound deal in 2015.'

    However, if we do want them back to residential use, is this really what we want - bedsits for 'young professionals'?

    'Developer Rainbow Properties hopes to submit a planning application in the coming weeks, but has already admitted it wants to level the entire string of houses to clear the way for rented rooms with shared kitchens and social spaces.'

    I understand your point Grenners, but what's being proposed here doesn't sound like the kind of ideal development we should let people drop character buildings for.
    You are invited to a public exhibition to view plans for new homes and residential accommodation
    at the site of 3 to 27 Wilberforce Road. The new homes will mean a comprehensive
    redevelopment of the site outlined in red.
    The exhibition will take place at St John’s Church, Queen’s Drive, on Thursday 27th April from 4pm
    - 8pm. You do not need to let us know if you are planning to attend, but if you have any questions,
    please email
  • @grenners - I'd be the first person to argue that we need more density. London is by some measures the lowest-density capital city in the developed world. New York is twice as dense. Paris four times.

    However your assertion that "In other countries people accept residential buildings have an economic life and will be replaced eventually" is highly questionable -the most beautiful and successful cities take pride in their urban heritage and seek to conserve it. There are plenty of brownfield sites in London where redevelopment can be focused without destroying the existing heritage stock. The entirety of Metroland, with its low-quality, low-density housing, ought to be redeveloped before we start destroying Victorian buildings.

    The middle-ground, as in that recent planning application on Dagmar Road - is to preserve the Victorian facades while constructing a denser, taller building behind (ideally with set-backs on the new upper floors. Now *that's* a policy that *is* successfully used in other countries to retain heritage streetscapes while modernising buildings and providing more space. And it's what they should be doing on Wilberforce Rd in my personal view.
  • grennersgrenners Ferme Park Road, N4
    I was talking of my experience living in Hong Kong and other Asian countries, I'm totally right on that as they have hardly anything left. New properties are far more desirable than old refurbished ones there. They is no drag on modernisation. I get the point on redeveloping poorer quality buildings first and of course a lot of countries have very little quality building that's more than 100 years old. I feel there is so much baggage in the UK holding us back. Just look at the ridiculous situation of crouch end town hall. I'm not saying the plans are acceptable as I habe not studied them.

    Working in property and having some knowledge of the planning process the public always have objections and the planners too. The established method now is sadly to submit a planning application for something more than you aim for so that you sit down and make compromises ending up where you want to be and the council are happy. Aim for what you want and you will be forced to compromise more than you wanted to.
  • As many planners and architects have stated, the housing that offers the highest density, and also makes for the best community and social welfare, is low rise flats. Like mansion blocks - Peabody style - laid out in street plans.

    Why do people insist on believing that tower blocks are the way forward?
  • edited April 2017
    @miss annie Yep, mansion blocks are great. To be fair to Grenners argument, tower blocks are sometimes needed to create density in London precisely because we're not willing to replace our Victorian 2-3 story buildings with 7-10 story mansion blocks as are common on the continent (and, to be fair, in parts of central London) so the density has to go on smaller - and thus taller - sites instead.

    @grenners - yep that's true, it's true of parts of America too - and that's why a lot of of those places are bland, sterile, and bloody boring. I hear that's not true of Hong Kong, but Singapore, say, or Atlanta - those cities are horrible because they have virtually no heritage. The Singaporeans now regret having demolished so much of their old city as it was a) very liveable and b) a massive tourist draw. The surviving bits are now more or less like Disneyland. We should keep our best heritage areas - there are plenty of shite areas that can be redeveloped first. Again I'd demolish all of metroland and replace it with mansion buildings - you'd boost employment in that part of the world too so that not everyone needed to commute to the centre.
  • grennersgrenners Ferme Park Road, N4
    Even Prince Charles likes mansion blocks.
  • Architecture is the one thing I usually agree with Chas on.
  • Shorthand for the swathes of suburban housing built in zone 4+, especially in north and west London, connected by the tube extensions. Crap cheaply-built and ugly housing, too low density, hardly any pubs or services... think Ruislip.
  • Go on and tell them straight.
  • Time Out tells me that Ruislip has a beach.

    John Betjeman and Metroland
  • HRH is spot on on housing and architecture. Also gardening, pig farming and biscuits.
  • What is this proposal, student housing for non-students? Sounds awful but in the end they are replacing a hotel with what essentially sounds like a hotel.

    Why the uproar over losing Victorian housing now and not a peep when the houses on Seven Sisters Road, also former hotels, were pulled down for some awful looking housing blocks?
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