A greener recovery

rikki

(I'm hoping this twitter embed works otherwise this comment will be meaningless).

I saw this and immediately thought of its relevance to osborne road. I think the idea of a paved piazza has been raised before. Anyone any idea of how far it got - surely post-lockdown is the perfect time to revisit it for all sorts of good reaons.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Three parked cars doing nothing for society or 20 people enjoying urban life and supporting local businesses. Is it really a difficult choice? <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/copenhagen?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc^tfw">#copenhagen</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/frederiksberg?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc^tfw">#frederiksberg</a> <a href="https://t.co/b6cVqQOF92">pic.twitter.com/b6cVqQOF92</a></p>— Mikael Colville-Andersen (@colvilleandersn) <a href="

https://twitter.com/colvilleandersn/status/1276838649909456903

">June 27, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Arkady

(It think you can just post the URL for the tweet and it will do that automatically).

That would be great. We need more of that sort of thing for sure.

LukeG

We sadly wont get anywhere with the numpties in charge of the borough at the moment who seem besotted with the car

krappyrubsnif

All of the car parking outside the wine bar, Grannys, both hairdressers, the coffee bar and N4 Coffee should simply be closed to cars and pedestrianised. No argument.

joust

What's their reason for it? It doesn't feel like it's used for shoppers or that they make a lot of money from parking.

Maybe it's because there's a lot of flats crammed in that small area and need more street parking than a normal street?

rikki

I spoke to shopkeepers and yes, some is residential, but on average it's about half used for residents and half visitors/businesses. Due to CoVid fears people are more likely to visit cafes etc if they can sit outside, so for businesses, losing a parking place might be a reasonable trade-off for the increased income.

libertyhall

It’s an excellent idea to pedestrianise this area which could be regularly used for cafe space and also for some market stalls

krappyrubsnif

Has been talked about on and off since 1996 and the council was then sympathetic to the idea. But nothing done because.....you know. Somebody should do it now.

Arkady

...petition time?

Toddlesocks

Yes we really need a pedestrian social space in SG.

grenners

Does the council own those shops in the block?

LukeG

https://eforms.secure.haringey.gov.uk/ufs/CST_CACS.eb?FBT=CF&ebd=0&ebp=10&ebz=1_1593546334525 you can suggest there - completely agree. Let's jump on this. Get more greenery in there and a nice spot

LukeG

The small portion of road / parking is called Osborne road

rikki

Thanks for this link @LukeG - I've just submitted...

Suggestion details
Pedestrianise Osborne Rd at the corner of Tollington Park Rd and Stroud Green Rd. The road is not necessary for through traffic. Businesses here have suffered under CoVid and could do with a pedestrianised piazza in front where people can sit socially-distanced in the open air. Some market stalls could also attract new footfall and and local opportunities.
please limit your feedback to 5,000 characters (including spaces)

What you would like the council to do about it?
The council could immediately put in bollards for a trial road closure at very low cost, and authorise extended seating and market stall trading, with a view to making this permanent and levelling off the road at a later stage if the trial is successful. This should be part of a post-CoVid move to a greener, pedestrian-friendly, cycling-friendly city which is so desperately needed for so many reasons, including climate and ecological crisis, air pollution, and quality of life, as well as providing support to local business and encouraging social-distancing.
please limit your feedback to 2,000 characters (including spaces)

rikki

@grenners I believe so - will double check with shopkeepers.

grenners

The reason I asked is because the council will no doubt moan about budgets. Really though it could drastically improve the public space environment which might better support the tenants of the retail units. Some return on the investment for the council if it owns the shops could be a more secure rental income stream from the shop units, perhaps higher rents over the long term. Not sure if the council looks at it that way. If the council doesn't own the shops then maybe the freeholder would contribute towards a budget. It could do with the garden planters revamping, it all looks very neglected.

LukeG

I remember chatting to a lady in front of (is it called granny's?) Who said she owned one of the shops and she said there is an issue with people loitering and drinking there all the time, so actually reclaiming the space would be helpful for everyone.

Arkady

Even better than bollards- big planters. We could have a whip-around for them. It's been done guerrilla-style in some places with success.

Arkady

The Council did this themselves though: https://www.eastlondonlines.co.uk/2020/05/planters-appear-in-hackney-streets-to-block-traffic-and-aid-social-distancing/

krappyrubsnif

This reached an advanced stage in the 1990s. I don't know if anyone may remember this. There was a survey of the then residents, a blueprint and even a temporary one day road closure one Saturday with an exhibition and a consultation exercise in a tent. People were suggesting seats, planters, fountains, duck ponds, an ornamental clock tower, God knows what. It was fun but the trouble was it got into the hands of some well-meaning student architects and ended up as more or less someone's graduate project, and then fizzled out. The only thing that happened is the council put some new flowers in.

All the shops on that parade were empty, shut and derelict and it was a much worse drinkers den than it is now. What is really needed today is permission to close the road, couple of bollards and a decision to make longer term plan .... the funding , the paving and landscaping can come later.

I could eventually get in touch with one of the original designers who is now a grown up multi-award-winning architect, but therexare probably other experts on public space around, and I'd say securing permissions and basic funding first.

Muswell Hill did something like this on the corner outside the Odeon, I believe.

grenners

I think that's probably right. Too big a project is more likely to get stuck. Closing the road and doing a light touch would establish the principle and it would be easier later to justify the whole thing.

Arkady

Yep. Sell it as a limited trial scheme with temporary planters. Few people would want to go back. Ensuring that the shops were onside will be key. Getting the residents of Charter Court onside might be trickier, but I think some guarantees about new seating not being used after 10PM, increased eyes on the street = less crime, etc. It would be useful to know what rights those residents have to park locally, too, particularly disabled residents.

Are the councillors onside? Kristen Hearn is very keen on pedestrian safety.

rikki

Have had another word and shops are def owned by the council - suggestion link being passed around and at least one has already done it.

Wine shop has had problems with anti-social behaviour outside, AND will be looking to legally place more chairs/tables outside I'm sure.

I agree residents' parking will probably be the biggest hurdle. Apparently Cllr Gideon Bull has been very helpful in the past with shopkeepers. Anyone happen to have previous contact with him?

krappyrubsnif

When we surveyed Charter Court in the 1990s the reality was, as I recall, that virtually all of the residents we were able to speak to were Somali or other asylum seekers or similar, and almost none had a car. So parking wasnt an issue. Things may have changed. I regret I dont have any of that information to hand now.

Scruffy

Can the same logic be used to extrapolate the suggestion to pedestrianising SGR from Hanley Rd to Tollington Pk?

krappyrubsnif

No.

Ali

That last go on this was in 2015. The big black fancy gate came of it from the council, some sort of small local spending grant

krappyrubsnif

What gate?

Arkady

The one that encloses the yard behind Charter Court I think. Next to Baccus.

LukeG

https://www.islingtongazette.co.uk/news/environment/islington-neighbours-parking-space-planters-1-6724336

Ali

Yep that's them