Stroud Green Village

krappyrubsnif

Tremendous row brewing on Twitter between @neilgillseason and @ConnectN4 on rights and wrongs.......

krappyrubsnif

Sorry @seasonkitchen

Arkady

Hard to understand the bile. There's a long tradition of using 'village' to describe an urban community. So much so that it's in the dictionary as a sub-definition:<br><br><span style="font-style: italic;">1.1 A self-contained district or community within a town or city, regarded as having features characteristic of village life</span><br><br>I've been chatting to Neil from Season about this. The new Traders Association which has stated to use the #stroudgreenvillage tag include Paks, so can hardly be described as an agent of gentrification. They want to promote local businesses, and that seems like a worthy cause to me.

Sutent

@Arkady - what are the characteristics of village life?<div><br></div><div>If people in villages or who visit villages wear more wigs than non villages then it sounds sensible to change the name. It would be good to put the name Stroud Green in the London map. If Brixton is a thriving village then am sure Stroud Green can be </div>

JoeV

Do we really live in an area that has characteristics of a village life? <span style="font-size: 10pt;">Sounds twee to me and something an estate agent would think up.</span><div><span style="font-size: 10pt;"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Wouldn't #StroudGreenRoad suffice? Brands the area while being accurate at the same time.</span></div>

Arkady

I'm ambivalent about it, but I see their point - they're trying to encourage a sort of localism - use and promote your local butcher, grocers, pubs, restaurants, etc., as you would in a rural village. And avoid chains! <div>Using #stroudgreen might be a bit too broad for their business agenda, and using #stroudgreenroad is too narrow as they are promoting business elsewhere in Stroud Green too (WB Yates, for instance).</div>

poxy

<P>From <A href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stroud_Green#History">Wikipedia</A></P> <P><EM>In 1407 the area was called Strode, which is formed from the </EM><A title="Old English" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_English"><EM>Old English</EM></A><EM> 'stōd' and means 'marshy ground covered with brushwood'. It is recorded as Stowde Grene in 1546, the 'grene' suffix is </EM><A title="Middle English" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_English"><EM>Middle English</EM></A><EM> and means 'village green'.</EM></P> <P>So, Stroud Green Village = Stroud Village Green Village</P>

Sutent

I think it is an excellent idea if it promotes small independent businesses. I am not sure about village life outside London, but I have lived in villages in Asia. I am not sure when M+S, Waitrose, Pizza Express and Oliver Bonas come how they will fit into village life

Arkady

It's an interesting debate. What does define an urban village? Local, independent shops? Sense of community? Strong sense of identity? Schools & libraries?

krappyrubsnif

I seem to recall that when I started a different thread about Stroud Green being like a 'village' on the grounds that most of the local shopkeepers know me and pass the time of day, several people jumped down my throat to point out that living in a real village is awful. Everybody knows everybody else's business, the shop (if there is one) closes at 5pm, there is terrible in-breeding and there aren't any buses. Quite right. I think the Traders might rethink their terminology.

krappyrubsnif

How about #stroudgreenallnighthotspot or #stroudgreeninnercityhub

NorthNineteen

That N4connect fella comes across as a bit of twerp in that exchange - I can see where they are both coming from but Neil made his point so much better and more reasoned.  Personally, I'm not a big fan of the use of "village" in the London context except in a few notable examples.  But I think that promotion of Stroud Green is a good thing and we still have quite a few empty units along SGR so filling these should be seen as a good thing.<br>

Mirandola

Good luck to them with it, and if it helps local businesses then that's great, but, but, but the whole 'village' thing is almost unbearably naff. We don't live in a blasted village. We live in one of the greatest cities the world has ever seen. London is infinite and miraculous and incoherent and kind, I would love us to celebrate that rather than ape bucolic tweeness.

gardener-joe

...

miss annie

<p>Agree with Mirandola completely.</p><p>Over the years here we have had many a debate about the boundaries of Stroud Green and if I recall correctly neither Paks, W.B Yeats or Season are in Stroud Green. @Arkady was it you that had the boundary map things?</p><p>Interesting debate about what makes an actual village. Dalston  Stamford Hill, Spitalfields and Soho are all a comparable size to Stroud Green have strong communities, schools, libraries, independent shops but I don't think I'd class any of them as a village. maybe Soho ten years and more ago, not now.</p><p>I know lots of my neighbours, shop locally, belong to the WI and have a local allotment but prefer to think that I live in a lively part of London than a village. I live less than ten minutes walk from the busiest tube station outside Zone 1 for goodness sake!</p><p>With the best will in the world the stretch from the tube to Hanley Rd does not feel any more like a village than Holloway  Rd does (just with less cars) but hey ho, if it makes people more positive about their business and where they live then so be it.</p><p><br></p>

Arkady

Stroud Green could claim all those places. Proposed boundary (along with other local proposed neighbourhood boundaries from three years ago): http://g.co/maps/4b37c Survey results that I based it on: http://batchgeo.com/map/stroudgreensurvey

Arkady

<font face="Arial, Verdana"><span style="font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal;">Oooo er</span></font><div style="font-family: Arial, Verdana; font-size: 10pt; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; line-height: normal;"><br></div><div><font face="Arial, Verdana"><span style="font-size: 13.3333330154419px; line-height: normal;">

https://twitter.com/mjgw/status/578834122740797440

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Sutent

Looks amazing. I can't wait to tell people I live in a village now. I have always wanted to do that...

fabruce

Just received the same thing. Good thing that local businesses are working together. However i don t understand why other great restaturants are not part of this "association". Not sure about the village though. But in a day like this the area feels so great :-)

Arkady

I get the impression that it's early days, the new Trading Association hasn't been up and running long and is still finding its feet. I'm meeting them in a couple of weeks, and will report back.

kreuzkav

We live in a city, not a village.  Have people lost their marbles.  This crap is just peddled by shops and business.  Let's create a twee area so we can sell more stuff.  <div><br></div><div>Foaming at the mouth.  </div><div><br></div><div>A village is a civilisation of less than 1000 people in the middle of the countryside.  Am I missing something?  I know my geography. Has the the word 'village' been taken over by the jeep driving zero hours giving cretins called developers?  </div>

krappyrubsnif

London has forever been described as a city of villages. It's not to be taken literally.  It's a metaphor.  I don't expect a duckpond and a green.  I quite like it (though the shops are a bit posh, agreed).

fabruce

Maybe the concept of village is a bit forced, but the initiative of aggregating small businesses together is quite honourable, and it will prevent from turning the area into a collection of the usual (and super boring) chains that are thriving in most areas in London. <div><br></div><div>I think this is the main aim of the businesses operating in Stroud Green, rather than enforcing a concept of village that might be a little bit too ambitious and far from the nature of the area.</div><div><br></div><div>Stroud Green feels great. I think many people do agree on this. Let's see what this association will bring to the area and embrace the positive changes that will come from this.</div><div><br></div><div><br></div>

JoeV

<font face="Arial, Verdana"><span style="font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal;">If the aim is to promote businesses in the area then why leave out long standing shops that have served the community for decades. Do they simply not exist? Do the people they serve not exist? I think the Stroud Green Village Traders Association needs some diversity training.</span></font><div style="font-family: Arial, Verdana; font-size: 10pt; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; line-height: normal;"><br></div><div style="font-family: Arial, Verdana; font-size: 10pt; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; line-height: normal;">This label already being picked up in the worst possible way:</div><div><font face="Arial, Verdana"><span style="font-size: 13.3333330154419px; line-height: normal;">http://www.homeaway.co.uk/p852163</span></font><br></div>;

fabruce

That was a quick pick up of the label :-)<div><br></div><div>Regarding the other businesses being absent that's the first thing i noticed. I don't really understand why, but as Arkday said it's early stages, so i am sure the list will get bigger.</div>

Arkady

The Trading Association is a membership-based body - as I understand it the members contribute towards joint campaigns and initiatives. Perhaps not surprising or unfair that they don't feature businesses that do not so contribute.<div><br></div><div>I think Pak's is on there, and several of the pubs, so it's not just new businesses.<br><div><br></div><div>What I don't know is whether they have canvassed every business to see whether they want to join. I will ask them to comment.</div></div>

Arkady

Any chance that someone who has this card (@fabruce?) could take a sharper picture of the front and back of the leaflet and post it here? If you don't use Flickr or Photobucket you could email the pics to stroudgreen@gmail.com and I can do the hard part.

Arkady

@fabruce get's the 'Stroud Green (Village)er of the day award.<div><br></div><div>The people's bowling venue Rowans is on here!</div><div><br></div><div><img src="http://i974.photobucket.com/albums/ae221/Redarkady/IMG_1061.jpg"><br></div><div><img src="http://i974.photobucket.com/albums/ae221/Redarkady/IMG_1062.jpg"><br></div>

Arkady

It would be good to add Tony the butcher and the grocers too. That would lend weight to the whole urban village thing. Alas we have no real baker, let alone a candestick maker.

JoeV

Is Pak's on there? Doesn't look like it but I haven't seen a hard copy of the brochure. I get that the trading association is promoting its members, this isn't really a new concept. But it isn't strictly about localism or the community good, it's advertising. I can't fully articulate why the label bothers me but it does, like they are hijacking the neighborhood I live in. 

Arkady

Curiously Pak's isn't, though Peter Mudahey from Pak's is an officer of the Trading Association.